File: Date: 11/22/95 Start Time: 11:07:35 PM End Time: Unknown Lines: 182 Chat length: 37241 bytes Number of participants: 32 Participants: AnnMul, BACAZ, BBaxter492, CathyMor, Davi4d, EJWilcox, FMarieP, GFA Mead, GFS Bill, GFS RAnn, GFS Sam, JoelaH3114, Khpedd, KLHARTZ, Leighann97, LTruss, MaryARoots, Mfsmith37, NursDiane, Opie189436, PFGushue, POWELLMOM, RRicker679, Santhany, Sedward, Shoaf, Teeg1000, TSteptoe, VJOURNAL, White wido, WSalis, Zinzindorf PFGushue : Newfoundland fishery...So thank a Newfoundlander for teaching you how to survive.....:) AnnMul : The man said "I can't. my wife refuses to sleep alone." POWELLMOM : Pynn-how many people you feeding? Zinzindorf : PYNN DON"T over cook the BIRD !! :) POWELLMOM : Anyone from N.E.G. looking for McMillian? GFA Mead : +++++++++++++++++++ANNOUNCEMENT+++++++++++++++++ Mfsmith37 : Chuck, hang around with us turkeys in NE! Zinzindorf : NIGHT CINDY/PYNN GFA Mead : In about 10 Minutes, we will be having a SPECIAL THANKSGIVING TALK! BBaxter492 : ACCIDENT OUT FRONT BYE AnnMul : BBaxter492 - nothing serious I hope. GFA Mead : Cathy, are you related to BarryMor? Santhany : GFS Chuck...I know it's late , can I give you address for the French Canadian Heritage Soc= iety of Mich. for the newsletter? CathyMor : GFA Mead, no. AnnMul : Opie - did you get your question answered? Opie189436 : Yes Thanks Ann! GFS Bill : Hi Pynnhead Mfsmith37 : Pynn - glad you stayed! Davi4d : Been looking forward to the session this evening. GFS RAnn : Have no cousins in this room full of Yankees, 'xept adopted ones AnnMul : Good. GFS RAnn - I'm a Yankee and have no cuzzes here either except all the adopted ones GFS RAnn : Ann, well--at least you're a Yankee, LOL! Furthest north I've found a relative is Philadelphia :) GFA Mead : Tonight, we will be having a FORMAL chat on Plimouth COLONY and the History of Thanksgiving in Early America. Davi4d : Been runnin' my family lines all day for this. Mfsmith37 : Sam - how soon after your talk does it show up in the files? AnnMul : GFS RAnn - I was born in Brooklyn, NY and lived in NE for seven years. Been in NC 16 yrs. BACAZ : David You will pick up several cuzzes just in this room. Sam is one!!! Davi4d : Oh really? Drake? BACAZ : David No through Griswold and Spencer. Davi4d : Griswold and Spencer will work. How did you know? I guess it's apparent... or at least, someone's parent. AnnMul : TSteptoe - I work with a man named Steptoe TSteptoe : Hi! Anyone have anything on a Megquire family from Maine? BACAZ : David You just know who has who. Davi4d : BACAZ... just what Drake are we tied in... there were several Johns. TSteptoe : AnnMul: Who and Where? Mfsmith37 : Cuzzes Sam, Mo?, Pynn, Ken, Bill, your cuz Andy (my son) is here - say hi to him! JoelaH3114 : Anyone got Lyman HALL b ca 1810 in NY? AnnMul : His name is Ron Steptoe and he's in the Air Force at Pope AFB, NC MaryARoots : Hi, Khpedd. How're you? Ready for Thanksgiving? BACAZ : Sam David is a new cuz of yours!! David the first one. VJOURNAL : BACAZ: Any tie in with Virginia/KY Drakes? Khpedd : Yep.....my dau 10 miles away is having it! BACAZ : VJ nope CT Davi4d : CT also here and England. TSteptoe : AnnMul: I have a cousin Phil Steptoe who is connected with the Air Force but he lives in Annapolis, MD. MaryARoots : Khpedd, I'll be cookin' tomorrow for the clan here. lol GFA Mead : +++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++ ____________________ ____________________ ____________________ __________________________________________ Davi4d : GFSBill.. I understand we're cousins. Santhany : Hi...anyone out there from the Vermont area? GFA Mead : ANNOUNCEMENT.....WELCOME TO THE NEW ENGLAND SPECIAL INTEREST GROUP!!!!! Davi4d : Through the Griswolds or Spencers? GFS Bill : Davi--What line? MaryARoots : BACAZ. Got power tools, but am still learning how to use it. GFA Mead : PLEASE HOLD ALL YOUR COMMENTS FROM THE SCREEN! Khpedd : Mo....what did the above say???????? BACAZ : Mary You will love it!!! Davi4d : For who, Griswolds or Spencers? GFA Mead : ++++++++++++++++++++++++ANNOUNCEMENT+++++++++++++++ WE ARE ABOUT TO BEGIN OUR TALK!!!!!!!!!!! KLHARTZ : Snathany I have ancestors from the Brookfield, South Royalton areas of Vermont GFA Mead : PLEASE HOLD YOUR COMMENTS! Welcome to the New England Special Interest Group. Tonight--in honor of Thanksgiving, GFS Sam, GFS RAnn and GFH Crow will discuss the history of the Harvest Festival and Thanksgiving celebration in GFS Bill : While we are in Protocol, please hold your comments GFA Mead : early America, as well as the history of Plimouth, MA. We will be in PROTOCOL during their talks, which means please DO NOT send a message to the screen. After the talk, we will have a Q&A period. When you have a Q, send "?" to the screen or "!" for a comment. Wait to be recognized from the QUEUE before sending to the screen. You can type your message and have it ready to send when recognized. When finished, type "GA" for go ahead. Thanks and HAPPY THANKSGIVING! THANKS, AND I'D LIKE TO INTRODUCE GFS SAM! TAKE IT AWAY, SAMMY! GFS Sam : Thanks, Maureen. Gads, do I really want to handle this unruly, holiday group? Happy Thanksgiving to ALL of you! GFS Bill : Remember during PROTOCOL, type ?=Question !=Comment You will be called on in order GFS Sam : The reason behind the Pilgrims' voyage to America can be traced back to the religious upheaval that began in the reign of King Henry VIII. Henry denounced the Pope and created the Church of England, keeping the Catholic form, but substituting himself as the head of the church. Those who resisted the change were subject to imprisonment, confiscation of property or beheading. When Henry's daughter, Mary (Bloody Mary) assumed the throne, she restored Roman Catholicism as the official religion. But Mary died and her half-sister, Elizabeth I succeeded her and returned the country to the Anglican Church. Meanwhile, new dogmas were being espoused by John Knox in Scotland, John Calvin in Switzerland and Martin Luther in Germany. By the time James I took the English crown in 1602/3, England was divided between old-time Catholics, conforming Anglicans and a variety of Protestants. Among the latter were Puritans and Separatists, two groups who are still generally confused with each other. The Puritans were a movement within the Church of England. Followers of this doctrine believed that the original Christian faith had been corrupted by time and "human invention", and wished to restore the church to its ancient "purity". These "Puritans" were the ones who settled the MA Bay Colony and emigrated to America during the "Great Migration", between 1628 - 1641. The Separatists, on the other hand, fiercely believed that they were entitled to the right of freedom of conscience, thought and speech. They wanted to read the Bible for themselves and come to their own conclusions. If they could not worship as they wished in the established church, they wanted to right to withdraw or "separate" to set up one of their own. The established Church of England, however, DEMANDED that everyone do and believe exactly as they were told. It could not tolerate the existence of a Separatist society, and once again persecution became the order of the day. Those who refused to toe the line were locked up and the more stubborn were sent to the stake or gallows. In 1608 one group of Separatists, under the leadership of William Brewster and William Bradford moved to Holland which was far more tolerant of religious dissenters. They lived in Amsterdam for a year, then moved to Leiden/Leyden. Life was not perfect in Holland, though. Economic conditions were difficult, as most of the English were not citizens and could not benefit from the privileges thereof. Employment possibilities were very limited and many were forced to put their children to work. After 11 or 12 years, they decided to make the voyage to America. Not everyone in Leiden left in 1620. Some followed later, many others remained permanently. The Holland Separatists were joined in Plymouth, England by other Separatists and by people not of their faith known as "Strangers" with whom they had to travel for financial reasons. The voyage began in two ships; however, the "Speedwell" sprang a leak and had to return to Plymouth. On Sept. 6, 1620, the Mayflower alone set sail, and the rest, as they say, is history. The voyage could NOT have been a pleasant one. In addition to some mishaps at sea - a main beam split during a storm; and John Howland fell overboard, but was rescued - (Betsey, that's for you!) the conditions on the Mayflower left much to be desired. There were no sanitary facilities -just the traditional bucket. There was no place to bathe. One can only imagine the stench that exisited below deck in the narrow, cramped quarters. The North Atlantic is always cold and passengers found it difficult to stay warm. They lived on a montonous diet of hard tack, dried fish, cheese and beer. Their destination was in the Viriginia territory (where they had a patent for colonizing), but they sailed further north outside the Virginia limits. Exactly WHY they did this is not clearly known. Some have theorized that it as to escape the jurisdiction of the Anglican Church which governed Virginia; Bradford, in his history, maintained that they arrived in MA either "by accident or by treachery of Capt. Christopher Jones". Whatever the reason, they explored the Cape Cod area, the Provincetown Harbor, and on Dec. 12 they began exploring the Plymouth Harbor. 102 passengers sailed from England. One died at sea; 4 more died while anchored in Provincetown Harbor. The entire crew of the ship stayed with the settlers through the winter of 1620/21 and about half of them died before sailing the Mayflower back to England in April. Of the settlers, only 51 were still alive when the next ship, the "Fortune" arrived in November, 1621. While still in Provincetown Harbor, several of the group claimed that since they had not gone to VA, they had the right to live as they pleased and take orders from no one. Bradford said that the Mayflower Compact was, in part, a result of this dissension. The Mayflower Compact stated essentially, that each person would subject himself to majority rule. Every grade schooler is taught that the Mayflower Compact is one of the most important documents in American democracy. For its time, it was indeed a remarkable statement of new ideas and principles, but it was hardly "democratic" as we use the word today. The most obvious example of this is to examine who was permitted to sign it. It was first signed by those had had the right to use the title "Mr." - the elite among the group. Separatists and Strangers were equally represented. John Carver, who became the first governor, signed first, followed by William Bradford, Edward Winslow, William Brewster, Isaac Allerton, Myles Standish, Deacon Fuller, Chistopher Martin, William Mullins, William White, Richard Warren and Stephen Hopkins. Next the "goodmen" (the poorer and humbler freemen) were asked to sign. Only 27 of them did. Finally, a few of the servants were asked, or ordered, to sign. The women were excluded as they were not free agents, but the legal "property" of their husbands. The original Mayflower colonists struggled alone in Plymouth for nearly a year before other settlers arrived. They were not completely isolated, however, as English fishing ships and ships engaged in other colonizing efforts called on them. Many of the wives and children of the Pilgrims arrived in later ships, beginning with the "Fortune" and continuing with the "Shallop", "Anne", "Little James", TSteptoe : AnnMul: I had to leave the computer for a few minutes. I hope I didn't miss a message. GFS Sam : "Mayflower II", "Talbot", "Handmaid" and others. With the arrival of more people came the need for "elbow room" which meant the creation of new towns. Between 1633-1643 these towns were settled - Duxbury, Marshfield, Scituate, Yarmouth and Taunton. They were all extensions of the original Plymouth colony. Of all the myths and legends that surround the Mayflower, perhaps none is as strange as the use of the word "Pilgrims". The Mayflower passengers had no name for themselves as a group. The word was first applied to them by Bradford writing his history many years later, and did not become a household word in America until Bradford's history was rediscovered and published in 1856. It was only then that interest in the Pilgrims and the events in which they participated gripped the American nation. Thanksgiving did not become a holiday until 1863 when President Lincoln declared it a national holiday. The very first Thanksgiving was celebrated over a period of three days by the Pilgrims and neighboring Wampanoag Indians who supplied much of the food - venison, waterforwl, dried berries, shellfish and cornbread. There is no mention of turkeys. The Pilgrims did not dress in the drab clothes we have come to associate with the Puritans, who banned "gay apparel". Only on the Sabbath did they wear funereal blacks and grays. Normally they wore russet browns and Lincoln greens. Some had quite large and colorful wardrobes. Inventories left by the colonists reveal much of everyday life. Feather beds were a prized possession, passed down from one generation to the next. Other items frequently mentioned in the inventories were pewter ware, farm equipment, cows, oxen, books, pails, saddles, sheets and blankets, kettles, horses, tableclothes, looking glasses and even a case of liquor. Yes, the Pilgrims were NOT teetotalers and enjoyed their wine and beer. (In fact, they were suspicious of water and regarded this substance as a cause of their many ills.) They passed laws against various sexual acts and, being human, broke them repeatedly. There are numerous instances of the colonists being brought before their magistrates on charges of "fornication", "inconetinency before marriage" and "carnall coppulation". As punishment, law-breakers were usually fined or whipped or, in extreme cases, excommunicated. A typical case occurred 26 Oct 1686 in the Court of General Sessions and Common Pleas when Mary Sutton of Scituate confessed fornicication with Joseph Booth and was sentenced to a 5 pound fine. Mary Sutton, under oath, testified that Joseph Booth was the father of her child and charged him with "Divers times bodily and Carnall Knowledge of her within the months of April and May, 1686." I am particularly amused with this account, as Mary Sutton is my 7g grandma! She was married to Benjamin Booth, Joseph's brother! (So much for MY family tree, huh? ) The Pilgrims had to work very hard in order to survive. There were butchers, carpenters, bricklayers, blacksmiths, tailors and wheelwrights. Fishing was an important industry, but the most important one was farming. A prosperous farmer tending land he owned was called a yeoman, socially just below the gentry - gentlemen addressed as "Mr." (pronounced "Master"). A husbandman cultivated crops though frequently on leased land. Below yeomen on the social scale came "goodman". A woman was called "goodwife", sometimes shortened to "goody". Plymouth was not the first colony to be settled in America. Roanoke Colony was established in the 1580's on Roanoke Island near North Carolina, though the settlers vanished without a trace. Jamestown was settled in Virginia in 1607, again earlier than Plymouth. The Dutch settled New Amsterdam by 1614. So why do we revere the Mayflower and its Pilgrims? Plymouth, unlike Roanoke and Jamestown, prospered. And the Pilgrims themselves did not come here seeking adventure, wealth or glory. They came here because of an idea - the idea that they were entitled to govern themselves. For anyone who wishes to become a member of the Mayflower Society, one usually joins the chapter of the State in which he or she lives. I have all State addresses available, but please e-mail me if you wish any address. To be considered for membership, you must be able to prove beyond any doubt, a straight blood line descendancy back to one of the original Mayflower passengers. This means obtaining copies of birth or baptismal certificates, marriage licenses and, as you go further back in time, other church records, deeds, land records, diaries, letters, census records, etc. Initially, the applicant is required to fill out a proposal form naming the ancestor through whom the person wishes to join the society and to cite the documentary proof. The society must then verify this documentation prior to acceptance of the proposal by the Board of Directors. Once the candidate's proposal and ancestor(s) have been approved, a set of lineage papers is provided to the applicant for completion in order to prove blood descent from the ancestor claimed. References: "Plymouth Colony, Its History and People 1620-1691" by Eugene Aubrey Stratton, Ancestry Pub. 1986; "Of Plymouth Plantation 1620-1647" by William Bradford, edited by Samuel Eliot Morrison, 1952; "Saints and Strangers" by George P. Willison; "Mayflower Increasings, 2nd Edition" by Susan E. Roser, 1995. And now GRATEFULLY passing the floor over to Rosie! AnnMul : ! Mfsmith37 : ? GFA Mead : ANNOUNCEMENT!!!!!! We will have our Q & A at the end of the talk! Thanks! Rosie, GA GFS RAnn : Thank you, Sam! Well, I get to give TWO chats tonight--the first one will be on behalf of GFH Crow, who was unable to be with us tonight--her chat deals with how the Native Americans celebrated Thansgiving before the Pilgrims arrived. So, here is GFH Crow's chat :) In a short time, many Americans will be joining with loved ones to give thanks for the blessings bestowed on them throughout the past year. Thanksgiving Day commemorates the original gathering of the Pilgrims in 1621, spawned by a bountiful harvest that saved them from a second devastating winter. They proclaimed the event to be a time for thanksgiving and invited the neighboring tribe of Wampanoags to join in the celebration. The Wampanoags did not hesitate -- for this was nothing strange to them; they had been celebrating thanksgiving for hundreds of years already. Native people all across Turtle Island (North America) have regularly offered celebrations of thanks for thousands of years; especially at harvest time. While most native nations practiced these ceremonies with the changing of the seasons or with the conclusion of a particular harvest, many did so at every solar event. The frequency of these celebrations tied to the spiritual ways of native people, that is, the desire to insure balance throughout all of nature. My people, the Nipmuc and Narragansett, celebrate thanksgiving several times throughout the year (which begins in the May). These ceremonies include Strawberry Moon, Green Corn/Green Bean Moon, Harvest Moon, Cranberry Moon and Maple Sugar Moon. Such celebrations occurred not only in the Northeast among Woodland tribes, but all throughout the continent. Perhaps the best known festival of thanks is the Green Corn Dance. The Choctaw, Narragansett, Creek, Pequot, Mississippian, Cochiti, Pueblo, Nipmuc and Mohegan were just a few of the native nations who extended their gratitude with a Green Corn Dance. Some of these tribes celebrated the harvest in late August /early September, calling to Kitche Manitou or Kautantowit (Creator/Great Spirit) to bless the corn fields and to offer their thanks for weather suitable for growing good crops. The Wampanoags were accustomed to this practice, thus when the Pilgrims extended the Thanksgiving invitation to them, they whole-heartedly accepted it and prepared to *party hardy*. The 55 Pilgrims were astonished to see more than 90 native men arrive with 5 deer to share. Pilgrims and Wampanoags offered thanks by dancing, praying and singing, followed by games and feasting. All this they would have done at their own Green Corn Dance, had the Pilgrims not extended the invitation. The native festival often lasted through the night for several days, including prayer, song, dance and either feasting or fasting depending on the individual group. Fasting sometimes occurred when the people felt that balance needed to be insured or restored. Instead of consuming the great amounts of the harvested food, it might be shared with the animal relations and this, in turn, would come back to them later by insuring good hunting throughout the winter. Green Corn Dance is only one of many different native thanksgiving celebrations. The Lakota Sioux nation, in late summer, offers its ultimate expression of thanks -- the Sun Dance. Ojibwa, Menominee and Winnebago people give thanks following their harvest of wild rice. Inupiat Eskimos dance in thanksgiving following a whale hunt. To whom do the native people offer their thanks? Common to most native beliefs, all things in nature have a special role: all things --every rock, tree, ant, and plant is important because it is part of the whole. Because of that importance, everything deserves respect and gratitude when used. Therefore, in addition to Creator being thanked, one might thank Father Sun, Mother Earth, Rain and the Plant people for good crops. When game was hunted anytime, not only for a celebration, the hunter would offer an apology to the animal, fish or bird about to give its life. Afterward, a prayer of thanks was extended to the victim and a gift offered, often sacred tobacco or food for its spirit. Sometimes a hunter would sing his own special song to thank an animal. Inupiat hunters offer thanks to the spirits of the whales. Some Woodland people offer maple sugar at the graves of their relations who have passed on, in gratitude and to provide nourishment for their spirits. Still today at many native feasts, before the food is eaten, it is blessed by a medicine person and a plate is prepared with portions of each food to be eaten. It is the best of the food, taken before anyone eats, and it is set off in a secluded area for the spirits of the ancestors joining in the celebration to share. They are thanked for their wisdom and their traditions, and honored with the best, not the left-overs. The feast was not the only aspect of the thanksgiving celebration. Sports, tests of skill and games of chance were popular, especially when a neighboring tribe or several bands within a tribe gathered. Competition was welcomed. Dancing and singing were and still are a large part of the feasts. Dances can be expressions of one's self and are often offered as prayers. Dale Carson, Western Abenaki, once said of dance: *The dancing --patting of feet -- are all at once a kiss, a thank you and a prayer to our Mother Earth....* Thus, there were dances specific to the occasion and dances by the individual; those that were solo, and those for which the entire group participated. And so, friends, as we gather with the ones we love this Thanksgiving, remember that the Pilgrims' *First Thanksgiving* was actually THEIR first thanksgiving on Turtle Island. Celebrate the goodness of all that is around you, and.... don't forget to dance! :D That concludes GFH Crow's chat :) Now, I'll need a minute to get my own chat set up--talk amongst yourselves :) (I won't give you a topic )... GFA Mead : THANKS, ROSIE for CROW! Davi4d : ? GFA Mead : Davi? Davi4d : How late will this forum be open? GFA Mead : We will be open for another hour! Welcome GFS RAnn : Okay, I'm ready :) GFA Mead : Okay, thanks ROSIE GA Davi4d : Will there be open discussion at some point? GFS RAnn : Now, my portion of the chat will deal with how the Native Americans' part in the first GFS Bill : Please observe PROTOCOL, type ?=Question !=Comment You will be called on after talk GFS RAnn : Pilgrim Thanksgiving :) Oops--take out "how" from that sentence :) In the winter of 1616, an infection ravaged the natives of the coastal territory known as New England with a viciousness that made the historical recorders of this event think of smallpox and yellow fever. An unprecedented force in the wilderness region, the plague was brought by European traders and adventurers whose ships were exploring the yet unsettled lands. In the two years during which the fever spread through their villages, perhaps a third of the peoples living between the Narragansett Bay and the Piscataqua River died. Tribes that had been flourishing and strong grew weak; weak tribes disappeared. Among the tribes that were nearly swept out of existence was a tawny strong-limbed group of people called the Massachusetts. Before the plague they had been one of the most powerful of the Algonquin people, and their dialects could be heard from the Virginia Tidewater to the rim of the Canadian Arctic. South of the Massachusetts on the curve of a sheltered bay, lived the Wampanoags, who had also been decimated by the fever. Whole villages had perished on the shoreline, leaving the land open for settlement. Europeans had fished and traded on the northern coasts of the New World for years, but the first to settle and survive were the "Saints" of a separatist church--that group which we know through our American History classes as Pilgrims. On September 6, 1620, the Pilgrims, together with many others who had joined the venture in hopes of improving their lot, set sail in the Mayflower for what they expected to be Virginia. For two months the small ship braved the strong winds of the fall weather to move westward over the vast ocean. Then, in early November, a thin edge of land appeared over the horizon. As they drew closer, those on board saw that it was "Cape Cod" in New England, which had been discovered about eighteen years before. The Pilgrims scouted the cape and its environs for a month. Then, just before Christmas, they crossed the bay in a freezing rainstorm to a harbor they thought suitable for settling. On Christmas Day, they began to erect the first house of their colony, which they called Plymouth. Situated on high ground, it had a commanding view of the harbor. There was no forest adjacent--a protection from attack--while the fields around were already cleared and had been cultivated for corn. It was not for several months that the Pilgrims learned that they had settled in a village which four years earlier had been called Patuxet, one of the communities obliterated by the plague. The first winter in the New World was harsh on the Pilgrim settlement. Weakened by their ordeal at sea, the settlers were wracked by scurvy and pneumonia. In three months, half of all those who had come on the Mayflower had been buried in graves beneath the New England snow. Then, about March 16, 1621, as the Pilgrims gathered to discuss their colony's situation, a tall raven-haired warrior, naked except for a leather fringe around his waist, strode into their midst and began to welcome them in broken English. His name was Samoset, sagamore of Pemaquid. His English was learned from the fishermen and adventurers who frequented the northern coast in the early years part of the seventeenth century. Eight months before, one of their ships had carried him to the cape to stay among the Wampanoags, the principal tribe of the surrounding region. Now he explained to them that they had planted their New Plymouth in the destroyed Patuxet village of this tribe. Samoset's talk extended into the evening, and the Pilgrims showed their hospitality to their guest with a festive dinner of pudding, duck, and "strong water". When Samoset left the following morning, he promised to return with members of the Wampanoag tribe and their sachem, Massasoit, and to bring beaver for trade. The colonists presented Samoset with a ring, a bracelet and a knife as tokens of gratitude. Four or five days after Samoset's visit the Wampanoag sachem arrived at the outskirts of Plymouth with sixty of his warriors. Their faces were painted and some wore skins, while others were naked (obviously a hardy tribe to be naked in New England in March ). A long knife hung from Massasoit's chest, his face was painted red with deep mulberry, and as his special mark he had a "great chain of white bone beads about his neck". Behind his head hung a little bag of tobacco, which he offered to the Pilgrims as they came to meet him with gifts. When Massasoit departed, he left behind his interpreter, Squanto, a native of Patuxet. Squanto's English was better than Samoset's. He had been kidnapped six years earlier by an English adventurer named Hunt, who had abducted twenty Patuxet and seven Nauset braves and sold them into slavery in Spain for twenty pounds a head. Later Squanto had been released from capitivity and shipped to England. In 1619, he had returned home to find his family and entire community wiped out by the plague. Squanto showed the Plymouth settlers how to plant and tend seeds native to the area, so that a crop would be ready for the next winter. He showed them how to set the seed and fertilize it with fish caught in the Town Brook. Soon the Pilgrim community came to regard Squanto as "a spetiall instrument sent of God for their good beyond their expectation." In mid-October 1621, Massasiot and ninety of his braves were invited to Plymouth for a three-day feast of Thanksgiving, to celebrate the peace between their peoples and the harvest that Squanto had sown. (Squanto himself died less than a year afterward, stricken suddenly with the plague. He bequeathed his possessions to the Pilgrims as "remembrances of his love".) The Pilgrim historians have not left us any "bill of fare" for this celebration, but we can gather from some writings of the time some knowledge of what they may have had during the feast. Certainly, seafood was abundant--the natives provided oysters and the best varieties of fish to their new neighbors. Ducks and geese were also plentiful, as well as other game (especially venison and partridges). And , with all respect to my good friend GFS Sam, my source reports the following: "And, above all, they had the turkey, of which they found a 'great store' in the forest--the turkey, thus early crowned queen of their bounty, and to which example their descendants, even though they may have failed to imitate them in other respects, have always been loyal." Also, there was bread--both the barley loaf and cakes of Indian meal. As for vegetables, there were a number of possiblities--parsnips, carrots, turnips, onions, and squash among them. The Pilgrims had allowed the pumpkins vines to climb their cornstalks and it is possible that one of our most traditional Thanksgiving dishes graced this feast--a pumpkin pie. Strawberries, gooseberries and raspberries were out of season, but the Pilgrims may have dried some in the summer for later use, together with the several varieties of plums that grew in the woodland. Despite the fact we know so little of the actual occasion of the first gathering so long ago, we know enough of what was at hand to fairly say that it was a royal feast the Pilgrims spread that first golden autumn they spent in Plymouth, worthy of their Native American guests, and altogether credible to those of us who in just a few days will continue this tradition shared by both Pilgrims and Native Americans of a harvest celebration. And (with gratitude to my aching arms!), I can say that my formal remarks are CONCLUDED Mo, back to you :) GFA Mead : THANKS, Sammy, Rosie! Wei will now open it up for Q and A.... GFS Bill : Queue--AnnMul,Mfsmith37 GFS RAnn : Ann has left, I think :) GFS Bill : I think they have left---Queue empty NursDiane : ! MaryARoots : ! GFS Bill : NursDiane has a comment NursDiane : That was very interesting thank you! GFS Bill : Mary has a comment GFS RAnn : Thank you, Diane! :) MaryARoots : That was really great! Thank you! Loved it! GFS RAnn : Thank you, Mary! :) EJWilcox : ! GFS Bill : EJWilcox has a comment GFS Sam : Cuz Elliot, go ahead. EJWilcox : Very intersting--especially why Mass Bay was lightly populated in 1620. Many thanks MaryARoots : ? GFS Bill : Mary has a question GFS RAnn : Mary, please go ahead :) MaryARoots : I missed part of it on the Indian info. Can I somehow retreave what I lost? GFS RAnn : Mary, certainly--I'll be happy to send you either or both of the texts I used tonight... Or, you'll be able to download it from the library by...next week, Sam? :) MaryARoots : ! GFS Bill : Mary has a comment GFS Sam : Rosie, in the Lecture Library, yes! MaryARoots : I was bumped while I was downloading it, so it's just part of about 2 or 3 min. GFS Bill : GA Mary GFS RAnn : Mary, was it the second part (GFH Crow's part), or my part? :) MaryARoots : Crow's part, I think. GFS Bill : Queue is empty---Any more questions or comments? GFS RAnn : Mary, it's in your mailbox now :) Leighann97 : hi, can anyone here help me? GFS Sam : Let's open up to OPEN CHAT - and thanks for your indulgence tonight in a long chat! MaryARoots : Thank you, RAnn. :) White wido : Thanks, Sam, Rosie,I enjoyed very much, Great job done by the 3 of you.. :) GFA Mead : Sam, That will be FINE Thanks forthe GREAT talks! GFS Bill : Great talks-clap,clap,clap Thanks Sam & Rosie GFA Mead : ::::::::::::clap, clap, clap::::::::::::::::::::::: GFS Sam : :::::::shaking hands with Rosie:::::::::: GFS RAnn : :::::patting Sam on the back:::::: :) :) GFS Bill : Welcome all to New England Genealogy--We are now in Open Chat Leighann---Did you have a question? LTruss : BROOKS, HOTCHKISS, BARNES, PAYNE, FROST, SEELEY, SANFORD, WAKLEE all in CT MaryARoots : RAnn. I gathered from Crow's talk that she is a descendant of the Naragnasett tribe. GFA Mead : Teeg, what families are you tracing? RRicker679 : Is there any POITRAS on line from Maine Or New Jersy? MaryARoots : I would like to talk to Crow about the Narragansetts. Khpedd : Who was wife of Thomas SCRANTON, b. c 1620?, of RI Teeg1000 : darbe GFS RAnn : Mary, you can write to her under either of her screen names--Watchcrow or GFH Crow :) White wido : ANDREWS,BEAMSLEY,BEN OIT,BRIERLEY,BROWN,D AVIS,DUGAS,ELSEMORE,FARRELL,FENLASON,FOLSOM,FOSTER Khpedd : Need parents of Mary -----, wife of Nathaniel BOWDITCH / BOWDISH. She died 25 May 1740 in RI. Leighann97 : GFS Bill -yes I have a question EJWilcox : BOSS, BRADY, CHASE, CUTLER, lARKIN, OATLEY, SHERWOOD, WASHBURN, WILBER White wido : GOOCH,JACKSON,JORDON ,LELAND,MCDOWELL,PAC KARD,PEABODY,SANDERSON,SMITH,THING,WOODWARD,WHIPPLE, Khpedd : TENNANT, TEFFT, FONES, BEAMAN.......RI early MaryARoots : Massachusetts----> BAKER, BEARSE, BRADBURY, CARR, DOTY, FAUNCE, White wido : GODFREY,WILLIAMS MaryARoots : FORRESTER, GODFREY, KIMBALL, MOODY, PEASLEY, PERKINS, PRATT, PRESTON, PRIEST, RICHARDSON, RIGGS, SEARS, WINSLOW LTruss : White Wido what Gooch's are you looking for? GFA Mead : KenCuz, do you connect with GFS Bill on his BEEMANs? White wido : Lt, William Gooch Sedward : MaryARoots, where are your KIMBALL's?? Shoaf : Hello. I have a question. Leighann97 : GFS Bill???? LTruss : I am also a descendant of his MaryARoots : Sedward: Mass. intermarried with Peasley GFS RAnn : Leighann, did you have a question for GFS Sam or me about our chats tonight, or was it related to something else? :) Khpedd : Mo......I don't have BEEMAN. Oops. I meant BRAMAN / BRAYMAN Leighann97 : I came in late, White wido : William Gooch, from Machias , Maine Leighann97 : But I was wondering if you would be able MaryARoots : New York----> GEE, HOOD, PADDOCK, ROOT, SHERMAN Vermont------>CARR, HARRINGTON, HEATH, LOWELL, YOUNG Leighann97 : to tell me how to use the search? MaryARoots : Delaware--->Stidham Shoaf : Is it possible to access the LDS genealogical library from here? Sedward : Maureen, I have the first weekof 1996 off!!! GFA Mead : Oh, I see Ken! Leighann97 : ? BACAZ : DRAKE/ LOOMIS/ RICHARDSON/ WHITE/ ROOT/ WOLCOTT/ STANLEY GFA Mead : Shoaf, sorry I'm afraid that's not possible. It would be GREAT if it was, tho, LOL Shoaf : ok. thanks. GFA Mead : Sharon, terrific!!! Let's meet at the SUTRO! White wido : LT, was your Wm. Gooch from Maine? Sedward : MaryAR, I have SHERMANS in the late 1600's to early 1700s in CT. LTruss : I don't know if he was or not what year was you William Gooch born? Sedward : Maureen, you know any good places to study genealogy???? MaryARoots : Sedward: Do you belong to the Sherman of Yaxley interest group? White wido : LT, give me a minute Sedward : MaryAR, No, I don't but I would be interested. BACAZ : David Your back!! FMarieP : Haven't been here in a while...thought I'd stop by and wish all a Happy Turkey Day!! Davi4d : I'm trying to make some cuz connections. I have with BACAZ but he won't tell which Drake!! LTruss : White wido do you know who he was married to? MaryARoots : Sedward> It's really neat. We meet once a month in a private room. There's abt 47 of us Sedward : MaryAR, room for one more?? MaryARoots : Sedward. We have a lot of Sherman's there & from all over. BACAZ : Daivd I will hang on!! That is a she BTW Khpedd : Martha WILCOX, b. ca 1725/30; d. Stonington CT 1815;m. Daniel BURDICK WSalis : SALISBURY, SODEN, HELMS, HAYES GFS Sam : You all have a GREAT thanksgiving!